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	<title>Comments on: Getting past labels</title>
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	<description>Explorations in evolving the understanding, living, and teaching of Nonviolent Communication</description>
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		<title>By: Markus Pallo</title>
		<link>http://nvc-evolves.org/posts/getting-past-labels/comment-page-1/#comment-169</link>
		<dc:creator>Markus Pallo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 16 Mar 2008 11:26:55 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Hi Conal,

thanks for remembering me the identifikation of the ego and bring back the awareness of this to me.....

You wrote:
------------
If I say “facilitation”, “training”, or “handling notes”, I am more likely to remember that what I (temporarily) do is not what I am, which is less interesting to my ego.
------------

For me &quot;facilitation&quot;, &quot;training&quot; and &quot;handling notes&quot; are also a short hand to each single movement and action i am doing in every single moment. So my fingers go down take something which i name note and the other hand hold something named pencil and the hand moves, so the result i name letters.....

As more i am using short hands, as more i am indentified with these ...

Some days ago, i was driving a car and told myself, i am tired, car driving is very stressy. So i checked.... I am here in this car. Sitting on something named seat. One feet is on the gas pedal. Four of my fingers are holding the wheel and so on..... It was not a big effort driving a car, there was no stress anymore ...

So what is making trouble, interpretation and short hands ?

Markus</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Conal,</p>
<p>thanks for remembering me the identifikation of the ego and bring back the awareness of this to me&#8230;..</p>
<p>You wrote:<br />
&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;<br />
If I say “facilitation”, “training”, or “handling notes”, I am more likely to remember that what I (temporarily) do is not what I am, which is less interesting to my ego.<br />
&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;</p>
<p>For me &#8220;facilitation&#8221;, &#8220;training&#8221; and &#8220;handling notes&#8221; are also a short hand to each single movement and action i am doing in every single moment. So my fingers go down take something which i name note and the other hand hold something named pencil and the hand moves, so the result i name letters&#8230;..</p>
<p>As more i am using short hands, as more i am indentified with these &#8230;</p>
<p>Some days ago, i was driving a car and told myself, i am tired, car driving is very stressy. So i checked&#8230;. I am here in this car. Sitting on something named seat. One feet is on the gas pedal. Four of my fingers are holding the wheel and so on&#8230;.. It was not a big effort driving a car, there was no stress anymore &#8230;</p>
<p>So what is making trouble, interpretation and short hands ?</p>
<p>Markus</p>
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		<title>By: conal</title>
		<link>http://nvc-evolves.org/posts/getting-past-labels/comment-page-1/#comment-13</link>
		<dc:creator>conal</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 26 Feb 2007 16:39:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://evolve.awakeningcompassion.com/posts/getting-past-labels/#comment-13</guid>
		<description>Thanks for sharing this clarification, Maggie.  I understand that the &lt;em&gt;intent&lt;/em&gt; of sociocracy is in harmony (mostly anyway) with the values I described in my post.  That&#039;s why I&#039;m pursuing it.  I&#039;m glad other readers of this post get to read Sharon&#039;s description, thanks to your response.

At odds with the &lt;em&gt;intention&lt;/em&gt; of sociocracy (and NVC) are strong ego (identity/status) &lt;em&gt;habits&lt;/em&gt;.  In writing and sharing &quot;Getting past labels&quot;, I want to support putting the intentions into effective practice by undermining the old habits and nurturing new ones, via some awareness and verbal skills.  Since language influences thinking so profoundly, I like to consciously align language with intention as well as possible.  The language shift I&#039;m suggesting aligns better for me than what I&#039;ve been hearing (including in Sharon&#039;s note), because it names tasks (activities, responsibilities) rather than people, i.e., it labels what &lt;em&gt;we do&lt;/em&gt; rather than what &lt;em&gt;we are&lt;/em&gt;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for sharing this clarification, Maggie.  I understand that the <em>intent</em> of sociocracy is in harmony (mostly anyway) with the values I described in my post.  That&#8217;s why I&#8217;m pursuing it.  I&#8217;m glad other readers of this post get to read Sharon&#8217;s description, thanks to your response.</p>
<p>At odds with the <em>intention</em> of sociocracy (and NVC) are strong ego (identity/status) <em>habits</em>.  In writing and sharing &#8220;Getting past labels&#8221;, I want to support putting the intentions into effective practice by undermining the old habits and nurturing new ones, via some awareness and verbal skills.  Since language influences thinking so profoundly, I like to consciously align language with intention as well as possible.  The language shift I&#8217;m suggesting aligns better for me than what I&#8217;ve been hearing (including in Sharon&#8217;s note), because it names tasks (activities, responsibilities) rather than people, i.e., it labels what <em>we do</em> rather than what <em>we are</em>.</p>
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		<title>By: Maggie Dutton</title>
		<link>http://nvc-evolves.org/posts/getting-past-labels/comment-page-1/#comment-12</link>
		<dc:creator>Maggie Dutton</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 26 Feb 2007 14:13:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://evolve.awakeningcompassion.com/posts/getting-past-labels/#comment-12</guid>
		<description>In Sociocracy it is not about identity and status...it is about roles and responsibilities.  As Sharon Villiness wrote to the Sociocracy group...in case you missed this perspective. Maggie

&quot;What sociocracy does is (1) treat all individuals as equivalent and (2)
clarify what roles and functions they are supposed to be filling in the
organization. It does a lot of other things as well but for the
purposes of this discussion, those are the most important.

If the group has elected you as the secretary/logbook keeper, then that
is the role they expect you to fill. That role has certain functions
that are important for the success of everyone in the circle. Calling
meetings, arranging the meeting room, confirming attendance, keeping
good notes, having previous notes and documents available for the
meeting, tracking the agenda items, etc. It is an important function.

The same for the Operational Leader, the Representative, and the Circle
Meeting Facilitator. The circle depends on all its officers to do their
jobs in the same way that a group would expect you as an NVC trainer to
do your job when you are teaching a group NVC.

That doesn&#039;t mean, however, that people are anymore important as
individuals. The consent of the secretary/logbook keeper carries no
more or less weight than the consent of someone who has not circle
roles or functions beyond being a member. In the circle meeting
everyone is a peer. Everyone&#039;s arguments are evaluated equally.&quot;

Sharon</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In Sociocracy it is not about identity and status&#8230;it is about roles and responsibilities.  As Sharon Villiness wrote to the Sociocracy group&#8230;in case you missed this perspective. Maggie</p>
<p>&#8220;What sociocracy does is (1) treat all individuals as equivalent and (2)<br />
clarify what roles and functions they are supposed to be filling in the<br />
organization. It does a lot of other things as well but for the<br />
purposes of this discussion, those are the most important.</p>
<p>If the group has elected you as the secretary/logbook keeper, then that<br />
is the role they expect you to fill. That role has certain functions<br />
that are important for the success of everyone in the circle. Calling<br />
meetings, arranging the meeting room, confirming attendance, keeping<br />
good notes, having previous notes and documents available for the<br />
meeting, tracking the agenda items, etc. It is an important function.</p>
<p>The same for the Operational Leader, the Representative, and the Circle<br />
Meeting Facilitator. The circle depends on all its officers to do their<br />
jobs in the same way that a group would expect you as an NVC trainer to<br />
do your job when you are teaching a group NVC.</p>
<p>That doesn&#8217;t mean, however, that people are anymore important as<br />
individuals. The consent of the secretary/logbook keeper carries no<br />
more or less weight than the consent of someone who has not circle<br />
roles or functions beyond being a member. In the circle meeting<br />
everyone is a peer. Everyone&#8217;s arguments are evaluated equally.&#8221;</p>
<p>Sharon</p>
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